TimHuber

85 months ago

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Are Sportbikes Nearing Their Zenith of (Engine) Performance?

Potwin, Kansas, United States

Are Sportbikes Nearing Their Zenith of (Engine) Performance?

The 250hp RSV4 R FW GP

The 250hp RSV4 R FW GP

Let's face it, non-entry level sportbikes just aren't selling like they were a decade ago. With sales figures at an all-time high, in the mid-2000's manufacturers had more reason then ever to invest in the development of sport bikes which lead to somewhat of an arms race resulting in some truly mind-blowing specs. Arguably the most advanced and competitive division of any motorcycle company was sport bike development so it's no wonder how we ended up with sub-400lb machines producing over 200hp at the rear wheel.

We could build 10,000HP bikes but we can only use what the tire can handle

We could build 10,000HP bikes but we can only use what the tire can handle

But inspite of all the progress, it appears these race bikes for the streets (and track I suppose) are nearing a plateau of sorts and not just because of drying up sales numbers. We very well may be coming ever closer to the peak of what's physically possible, or at least getting damn near it. Tires can only handle so much acceleration, only so much power can be put down before a wheel will just spin in place instead of accelerating you forwards.

A Magneti Marelli ECU

A Magneti Marelli ECU

Modern engines are for a lack of better words, perfect. They produce so much power in fact that those building new bikes are much more focused on evolving the electronics that keep said power in check, enabling the bike to actually be ridden. This is done via ECU's and fuel mapping, traction control, and ever more advanced ABS with features like IMU systems to help slow the bike down from ridiculous speeds. So it's not about how to get the engine to produce more power, it's about finding a way to get the electronics to make that power more accessible, even MotoGP riders would have trouble running through any sector of any circuit without all these rider assists.

Next decade we might all own bikes just like those seen in MotoGP, though we probably won't ever be able to ride them like a particular young Spaniard (and world champion)

Next decade we might all own bikes just like those seen in MotoGP, though we probably won't ever be able to ride them like a particular young Spaniard (and world champion)

So what does this mean? Well there's good news and bad news. The bad news is that once bikes stop having better specs than previous model years, people will probably stop buying them. The 2017 R6, (though 600's are by no means popular sellers today) should be a good indication of how willing the market is to buy a new model with an unchanged engine, simply because of all new body work and a few extra bells and whistles the 2016 R6 lacked. That's almost certainly what will happen with future literbikes.

Same engine, new bodywork + some trick bells and whistles, Is it enough to justify sales?

Same engine, new bodywork + some trick bells and whistles, Is it enough to justify sales?

Offerings like the new 2017 GSXR1k's variable valve timing is the type of feature that will probably start popping up on new models as manufacturers are going to start having to really get creative to justify new models with last year's power plant.

Suzuki's VVT (Variable Valve Timing) is a brilliant new feature that is sure to bolster the new GIxxer's sales

Suzuki's VVT (Variable Valve Timing) is a brilliant new feature that is sure to bolster the new GIxxer's sales

The positive in all of this is more for riders of bikes rather than the companies building them. We've seen highly advanced race bred machines putting down up to 250hp, though at the moment these are elite machines, unavailable to the majority of riders and their income. Just like any other fancy tech or feature that trickles down from racing into production models, we should start seeing once cutting edge features become common and therefore affordable.

After a point, more power will just lead to a spinning rear wheel.....like this gentlemen

After a point, more power will just lead to a spinning rear wheel.....like this gentlemen

Forced induction may be an interesting byproduct of the new ECU/TC arms race of the twenty-teens. With the exception of Kawasaki's H2 & H2R, we haven't seen a production turbo or supercharged machine since the 80's when the big four (Honda, Kawa, Yammy and Suzuki) all were making turbo models, but with engine development reaching its zenith new selling points have to be discovered and power plants combusting at atmospheric pressure may in a decade be a thing of the past as forced induction machines start to become commonplace. Even today Suzuki filed a patent on a new turbo engine similar to their XE7 which they showed off a few years back.

The Ninja H2R, looks pretty great in white though it quickly becomes a blur when the throttle opens

The Ninja H2R, looks pretty great in white though it quickly becomes a blur when the throttle opens

Another silver lining here is that companies will likely come up with some pretty creative areas to develops. We can expect absurd service intervals on future models and work-horse-esque reliability. Engines won't change much but other aspects, mainly those surrounding aesthetics and convenience will.

This may actually be a reality at one point...

This may actually be a reality at one point...

The bad news in all of this is that it will hurt manufacturer's bottom lines, making it harder for them to bring us new and innovative technologies.

Also to clarify, I'm not just talking about homolagation specials, though I do expect features from those elite bikes to trickle down to common production models. Though carbon frames and whatnot have become commonplace on some of these ultra-exotic two-wheelers, it shouldn't take long for them to appear common on most machines as companies are going to need a damn good reason to get people to buy new models, especially when the engine is no different than previous versions.

Today's two most coveted homolagation specials. Carbon erythang

Today's two most coveted homolagation specials. Carbon erythang

So let's enjoy advancements while we can and look forward to the day we can all comfortably afford streetbikes with comparable specs to today's MotoGP machines. Will traction control and fuel mapping improve in the coming years? yes. Will we soon hit the peak of what is physically possibly, it really looks like it

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gggempire

85 months ago

@TimHuber

Yeah, the only way I can see performance drastically improving is through tires and what ive barely heard about; air foils/aerodynamics for stabilization and possibly increasing the already insane lean angles we can achieve, or prohibiting weelies but idk about any of that, by that time your going so fast your riding a plane with twi wheels. And I'd say that's pretty fast. I remember people accusing the dodge tomahawk of inacurate top speeds because its aerodynamics were garbage, and even though it had an insane engine the drage would be all over the place and would pull the rider right off the bike so that it couldn't even reach top speeds of bikes with FAR SMALLER engines like the Kawasaki H2R simply because of aerodynamics. But engine performance wise, I think your right. All we can do now is try to better control the power with aerodynamics, tires, and such.

TimHuber

85 months ago

@gggempire it's important to separate reliability and performance. I expect fuel efficiency, service intervals and those type of things to improve. As far as raw performance. I can't imagine how that much more power can be put down. 

 

To piggyback on what you're saying though, it should be interesting to see how companies go forward when deciding to either make their engines more fuel efficient or if they'll veer more towards electric power plants (I hope not).

 

i never had any idea how much fuel gets wasted/burned off. That's never been something I've cared about at all.but it's nonetheless interesting to learn

gggempire

85 months ago

I dissagree with the fact that engine performance can't get any better by a significant amount. Yes I agree that we can already fit a lot of hp in small lightweight engines, more than what can be used, due to weelies and such, but there is amother factor in engine performance thay can be GREATLY improved, efficiency. Now I know if you are racing, you really dont care what mpg's you are getting, but if we are strictly talking engine performance, efficiency has been very low for a long time. For most petrol engines, cars and motorcycles, only about 20% of the gas is actually turned drive work, where the rest of it leaves the exhast and radiator as waste heat. Its been this way for decades, mainly because atmospheric pressure doesn't allow us to fully expand the gass in the piston to "get all the energy out". So I don't know if its possible, but if some bikes already push 100 mpg at around 20-30% thermal efficiency, I cant imagine what they'd get if they got more like 80-90% thermal efficieny.

daveinwoodland

85 months ago

@TimHuber I agree too, I loved the three cylinder configuration, I also used to have a Triumph Daytona and loved that too, but I have to admit this is a really unique and different bike to ride.

The four cylinder cross plane makes me feel like I am riding on top of a big muscle car V-8, it's a very odd feeling both in sound and power delivery.

TimHuber

85 months ago

@daveinwoodland oh the new FZ-10. I hated the idea of making the FZ series which was always 3 cylinder into a four but after experiencing the R1 engine that's tuned for street use, it's hard to complain.

daveinwoodland

85 months ago

Truthfully, none of us can use what most of us ride when on a public road. I just bought a 2017 FZ-10 and it is way more motorcycle then I need, but is incredibly fun to ride.

I don't do track days anymore at my age but if any motorcycle is going to destroy my perfect driving record the FZ-10 is it. There are even more incredible ones out there but I want to milk my mortality as long as possible.